Card wishlist

[melvin]

I'm not sure I understand all the "no mana pool" things though.

No mana pool means mana ability can only be played when the game asks you to pay for a specific mana cost. The game asks for one mana at a time and there is no place to store the additional mana generated if the ability generates more than one mana at a time.

The reason this is simpler is because there is a one-to-one correspondence between mana sources and mana costs. Each mana source pays for one mana in the cost. The AI uses this assumption to generate the different ways to pay for mana. If a mana source can generate multiple mana, we'll need a new method of mana choice generation.

Duel - can we save in middle?
I'm having slow issues with the AI right now and I want to quit and save in middle, is that possible?

No, thought I'd personally love to see such a feature as it also means we can more easily debug AI problems. Maybe I should get to work on this.. the trouble is that it is quite hard to capture the full game state and load it back in the game.

[mecheng]

Thanks for the explanation about the mana pool stuff. Wish I were a programmer, this is probably fun stuff to work on. Along that line though thinking in general, it seems it’s almost there already.

Perhaps we’re asking the question the wrong way around. Instead of trying to be so clever as to see what might be possible (and highlighting what card could be used and starting with card selection), why not go the other way – start with mana tapping.
So on 1st main, no cards in hand are highlighted until you start tapping mana (or other sources) and supply = demand.
So here you may simplify things. You tap, you add mana to pool, then you use card if supply=demand, else you take burn.
Sorry if you’ve already been through this in programming, just a noob here wondering out loud.

[mecheng]

I think I saw someone else ask for a Tournament mode, and I second that.

Along similar lines, when playing a duel, the program asks you to pick a deck – either random or pre-constructed, but doesn’t seem to be a way to pick one we have created and saved – that would be a nice option. Yes, you can get there eventually, but save some clicking around.

Also, what about having the ability for the AI to play itself with the different pre-constructed decks (yours and ours) for stats? A bit hard to interpret perhaps given the less than stellar combat choices by the AI, but still something.

[mecheng]

Another option for slow AI issues (in addition to save in middle potential) might be a “force move” button. Most chess programs have these for the same reason – sometimes the AI just takes too long. I played a few games last night where the AI took 10 minutes to do nothing. A bit frustrating.

One of the places I see the AI struggle is regeneration – it will regenerate it’s creatures on its turn before it’s even done anything. Sometimes several times.

[melvin]

Perhaps we’re asking the question the wrong way around. Instead of trying to be so clever as to see what might be possible (and highlighting what card could be used and starting with card selection), why not go the other way – start with mana tapping.

It's an interesting idea, doing it this way would indeed allow various mana abilities. The only drawback, I can see is that the number of possible ways to tap mana is very high and only a small fraction of these ways correspond to cards in your hand. I think this can be fixed by only tapping mana if it helps you to cast one of the cards/abilities you control.

Along similar lines, when playing a duel, the program asks you to pick a deck – either random or pre-constructed, but doesn’t seem to be a way to pick one we have created and saved – that would be a nice option. Yes, you can get there eventually, but save some clicking around.

Good point, we can add a load deck option in the "New duel" dialog.

Also, what about having the ability for the AI to play itself with the different pre-constructed decks (yours and ours) for stats? A bit hard to interpret perhaps given the less than stellar combat choices by the AI, but still something.

There is a "Deck Strength" widget on the right side of the deck list. It uses the AI to play your deck against the AI's deck automatically. Is this what you are looking for?

[mecheng]

Thanks for the response.
As to mana tapping:
Yes, the number of both sources and total value of mana potentially generated in this way would most likely always be > the need for casting the cards in hand (or activating abilities). However, you do not need to figure out a "control" method at all, you simply have any overflow go to manaburn damage. This logic would actually simplify your code by quite a bit I think. And allow a wider range of cards and strategies.
The difference is the manaburrn, as you do not have a logic for this now. By design you force supply = demand and have no way to have supply < demand or supply > demand. But by introducing manaburn, you get all 3 options.
So now instead of running check on both amount and types of supply = demand, all you ever have to do is check at the end of each phase if there is leftover supply (supply >0) and if so, each value > 0 = damage.

New duel
Yes, that is one solution. I was also thinking of something along the lines of what you have now though. When I got to the new duel screen it pops up options for me and the computer. and it has *some* of the pre-constructed decks as options (like Elf Horde) but not all of them.

Deck stats
Yes, the widget thing is cool, but I guess I was thinking of something also like a historical chart. Like say I created a deck called FUN. And O played it 7 games against Elf Hordes and 7 against Knights, etc. I'd like to be able to see how it did against all decks it ever played. This offers different information as it's not only an indicator of deck strength but also how well I'm playing it.
This would definitely be nice to have alongside any kid of tournament mode enhancement you make.

Thanks

[Aswan jaguar]

About manaburn mecheng that rule isn't valid for some years.The surplus mana just goes unspent.
If you want to play with manaburn try Shandalar where it is still valid.

[mecheng]

Hey, thanks for the rule update. As I said, been out for awhile. That sure takes the fun away from some earlier strategies then, wonder why they did that.
But as for as programming then, I would think the lack of that rule makes this even easier to implement since now you don't need check for supply = demand nor manaburn.
On the player's side anyway. I don't know what this would do to the AI programming but I would think the bulk would be the same since it should now be calculating total possible vs cards/abilities, so not much would change there, just more possibilities.
No manaburn though. Huh. Learn something every day I suppose.

[mecheng]

Off topic: poison / infect question
Seems infect is new to me and it works based on damage done.
Like if a 3/3 creature with infect damages player, the player takes no point damage but receives 3 poison counters.
Old creatures had poison, but where poison counter effect was predetermined (and not a factor of strength) but still did damage as well. And these poison counters only affected a player, not a creature.
Pit Scorpion and Marsh Viper are fun examples.
Is this still used / legal?

[Aswan jaguar]

Off topic: poison / infect question
Seems infect is new to me and it works based on damage done.
Like if a 3/3 creature with infect damages player, the player takes no point damage but receives 3 poison counters.
Old creatures had poison, but where poison counter effect was predetermined (and not a factor of strength) but still did damage as well. And these poison counters only affected a player, not a creature.
Pit Scorpion and Marsh Viper are fun examples.
Is this still used / legal?

Yes, both poisonous ability and it's successor infect are legal as far as I know.

[mecheng]

Wishlist cards
color fun stuff
Circle of Protection: all
Sleight of Mind
Spectral Shift
Mind Bend
Magical Hack

[spartan vi]

I've spent a good portion of my afternoon adding cards from the "Sole Domination" M13 precon deck.

Here's my wishlist of those I couldn't script myself:
Nefarox, Overlord of Grixis
Xathrid Gorgon
Gravecrawler
Geths Verdict
Sublime Archangel
Angelic Benediction
Edge of the Divinity

[downlink]

Intrepid Hero

I'd love the above card, and tried to do it myself but discovered it's tap ability isn't easily done.

[melvin]

Bold cards are implementable with the current game engine. Right now I have the card script for "Angelic Benediction", it was submitted by a. benedict balbuena via email. Likely this will be implemented, as we only have to write the code to implement its second ability.

For the implementable cards, it will be very helpful if the requester can provide the card script for the scriptable components of the card card in this thread, viewtopic.php?f=82&t=5894&start=15. The easier it is to add a card to the game, the sooner it will be added. Having a ready made card script with mana cost and other details filled allows us to focus on working out the implementation of the ability.

Circle of Protection: all
Sleight of Mind - change of text not supported
Spectral Shift - same as above
Mind Bend - same as above
Magical Hack - same as above

Nefarox, Overlord of Grixis
Xathrid Gorgon - "Its activated abilities can't be activated." not supported
Gravecrawler - casting from graveyard not supported
Geths Verdict
Sublime Archangel - "Other creatures you control have exalted." not supported
Angelic Benediction
Edge of the Divinity

[downlink]

Divine Offering

Revoke Existence