Manalink Update April 24 2009 - EXPERMIENTAL

[Tower_Mazer]

Put a copy of Momir into your deck, and it should pop into play automatically for both players.

OMG you did it! That is so awesome! This removes it from both the player and the AI library? Just out of curiosity did you do this because of my suggestion or was it a master plan? This is going to make the Vanguard cards so much fun! I figured you would pm me about that code I posted since it's backwards from the way C is coded if I'm correct (as in going trigger action, conditional, event instead of reverse). It probably wasn't of much use anyway since I know very little about card coding atm. Anyway awesome implementation of skill on coding! Keep up the good work.

[jatill]

The circle through the momir is to keep it from being targeted. I was tired of my Momir getting killed by Stomphowler, since it's implemented as an enchantment. The same would go for future avatars, and the rules engine, if I add activated abilities like Cycling.

I'm still having a few troubles with Vanguard. Maybe someone can offer suggestions.

Problem 1: If your vanguard avatar is the first card you draw, it doesn't get sucked out of your deck. I think I can add code somewhere to replace it with another card during your first upkeep, but that doesn't help with mulliganing.

Problem 2: I can't set the hand sizes correctly for Avatars at the beginning of the game. Again, I'd have to wait for the first upkeep to add or remove cards from your hand. Again, not a big deal except for mulliganing.

Problem 3: I notice that when I play momir I have 54 cards in deck and 7 in hand, even though my deck is 60 basic lands. Can someone identify what card is getting duplicated?

So I'm asking everyone:
How serious do you consider these issues? Would you like me to proceed with vanguard despite the problems, or wait until we have solutions?

[Tower_Mazer]

1) Can we have the Momir get searched in both the deck (1st) then hand if deck return false. Then have like a Time Twister ability cast off and give each player a new hand. As for the Mulligan we could add the current mulligan rules on the Rules Cards? Just have it as a one time use for each player by setting a boolean to true or false once the first upkeep ends to disable the mulligan ability at least making it return 0 when condition isn't true. Then we could Mulligan down as low as we want.

2) This can be done while the above code idea is working.

3) I built a deck with 12 of each basic land and 1 Momir for a total of 61 cards. Both myself and the AI were getting random basic lands as dupes. Then I made a deck with the first 59 gold cards and 1 Momir (60 cards). This is when I noticed a bug. Well I get my hand and my opponent does also (both displayed). His first card is Kasimir and mine is Godshire but we each had 2 copies at the top of our hands (which shouldn't happen). The Momirs get pulled from both decks and the AI hand is refreshed with new cards and he no longer has 2 Kasimir in his deck and instead his first card was Jasmine Boreal which he now had 2 copies of in his had. Mine stayed the same (Godshire). I repeated this and kept getting the same results just with random cards (always the first one the player draws). Also when the AI's hand is refreshed he only has 6 cards while the player gets 7.

[jatill]

1) Can we have the Momir get searched in both the deck (1st) then hand if deck return false. Then have like a Time Twister ability cast off and give each player a new hand. As for the Mulligan we could add the current mulligan rules on the Rules Cards? Just have it as a one time use for each player by setting a boolean to true or false once the first upkeep ends to disable the mulligan ability at least making it return 0 when condition isn't true. Then we could Mulligan down as low as we want.

Are you proposing that for Vanguard, we ignore the initial mulliganing and opening hand, and then during the game's first upkeep, simulate the mulligan process?

It might take some getting used to, but I think that would work. (If I can figure out how to write the Timetwister code!)

[Bog Wraith]

If you can figure out the code to get the hand size done automatically great, but frankly, I don't mind that I will have to debug some of the initial setup from game to game to match the parameters of the individual Vanguard cards that are in play. It's something that I expected to do anyway!

Heck, I'm going to go back to manually debug Momir into play as I don't like the red circle. Just a personal choice on my part. All I care is that the Vanguard cards work as they should.
So whatever manually needs to be done by me to get the Vanguard cards into play and the hand sizes correct is fine by me!

Besides, I'm pretty sure that later on if you would figure these things out automatically, the code could be changed to reflect these changes just like any other bug fix that you have implemented.

I've sent you a PM!

[mathusalem]

lol ! I will look up for these merde bugs -no seriously, most of the game works while the cards are translated

Correct i didn't update these land types, actually I tried to be as little invasive as possible for this translation (I only translated the card name, rule text and text.res) because I didn't want some well working elements to quit working just for this translation - besides I do not have the knowledge to fiddle too much with the game

Go ahead and update the land types for the Duals and Shock lands, and you should be good. Right now, things like Daze and Gush won't work for you either, except for basic lands.

where should I update those landtypes, is it in the csv ?

[jatill]

Yes, in the subtype and subtype2 columns. Compare the id's to any csv I've released in the last month.

[mathusalem]

right on ! thanks ! you remembered that I have used a csv that i have continually updated for the translation, I'm impressed !

[Tower_Mazer]

1) Can we have the Momir get searched in both the deck (1st) then hand if deck return false. Then have like a Time Twister ability cast off and give each player a new hand. As for the Mulligan we could add the current mulligan rules on the Rules Cards? Just have it as a one time use for each player by setting a boolean to true or false once the first upkeep ends to disable the mulligan ability at least making it return 0 when condition isn't true. Then we could Mulligan down as low as we want.

Are you proposing that for Vanguard, we ignore the initial mulliganing and opening hand, and then during the game's first upkeep, simulate the mulligan process?

It might take some getting used to, but I think that would work. (If I can figure out how to write the Timetwister code!)

You got it. This is kinda a two birds with one stone thing. You fix any Vanguard coming into play from hand or library issues and you still keep the ability to have a mulligan. I hope this works. It will be pretty neat to use the Vanguard cards without needing manual help. I can't believe you did it so fast though. By the looks of it though Bog Wraith can't wait till you start releasing some Vanguard cards even if in an Alpha/Beta stage.

[Bog Wraith]

I'll wait for whatever is best, but you are right, I am excited about playing with them!

Whatever works will be fine by me!

[Tower_Mazer]

I'll wait for whatever is best, but you are right, I am excited about playing with them!

Whatever works will be fine by me!

I know how you feel. I'm also looking forward to playing Vanguard decks again. Me and some friends that no longer play used to play with them all the time. Squee avatar w/ Empierial armor or Maro deck here I come. Currious to se what your favorite Vanguard card will be look no further. I'm going to have to say Squee was my favorite of the original 8 and my other favorites were Mirri and Volrath. At any rate being able to play them by yourself on the PC is pretty cool.

[jatill]

How annoying that Magic Online re-used the same avatars (ex: Squee) and gave them different abilities. I'll probably pick and choose from among the different sets. Of course, anyone with even an ounce of programming skill could create their own custom avatars, too. Maybe I'll include the jatill avatar

[mathusalem]

Cooool, so we could have an idea of how you look like !

[Tower_Mazer]

How annoying that Magic Online re-used the same avatars (ex: Squee) and gave them different abilities. I'll probably pick and choose from among the different sets. Of course, anyone with even an ounce of programming skill could create their own custom avatars, too. Maybe I'll include the jatill avatar

That's dumb they'd reuse them and give them different abilities. I havn't seen any for MTGO I'm going to go look there. I own and only have used the original 32.

[EDIT]

Jatill Avatar
Hand size +3
Life +5

At the start of game remove all land from your deck and shuffle them into a seperate out of the game pile. During your upkeep you may put 1 of the removed land into play under your control tapped. If you do this skip drawing a card this turn and lose 1 life.

I don't think it's to broken but maybe the hand size but it's 100% original and probably undoable. We have to give it to you though since you added so much life and cards to this game.

[jatill]

I don't think it's to broken but maybe the hand size but it's 100% original and probably undoable. We have to give it to you though since you added so much life and cards to this game.

Hmm... 53 lands, black lotus, channel, fireball. Sounds a little broken