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Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse » 10 Dec 2016, 11:00

Thanks for the feedback, RiiakShiNal. I'll be updating the list soon.
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse » 10 Dec 2016, 20:07

OP updated.

~30 cards added.

PM sent to Xander with text file for updating the list at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... =788224830
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse » 17 Dec 2016, 14:53

Is Assault Suit possible with it's "equipped creature . . . can't be sacrificed" text?
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Xander9009 » 17 Dec 2016, 15:12

Splinterverse wrote:Is Assault Suit possible with it's "equipped creature . . . can't be sacrificed" text?
You could override any sacrifices, but that wouldn't negate things like Barter in Blood.

http://blogs.magicjudges.org/rulestips/ ... ced-means/
That page talks specifically about the card, and it points out what most of us already realize: you can't use the creature to pay sacrifice costs. However, overriding the sacrifice probably wouldn't prevent the cost from being marked as paid. You'd have to test it to be certain, but I don't think it can be done without modifying anything that sacrifices from considering cards with a fake characteristic for CANT_BE_SACRIFICED to be valid choices/targets.

Hopefully, someone else has a solution because it looks like a really fun card. I'd personally be okay if it didn't interact properly with Barter in Blood type effects if it at least interacted properly with sacrificing as part of a cost (which is the intent of the ability).
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse » 10 Jan 2017, 10:59

Updated OP by adding Baral, Chief of Compliance.
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby thefiremind » 10 Jan 2017, 16:46

Splinterverse wrote:Updated OP by adding Baral, Chief of Compliance.
I think it should be possible to code by using the same trick I used for Guile (which should be already in the CW).
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse » 21 Jan 2017, 23:15

thefiremind wrote:
Splinterverse wrote:Updated OP by adding Baral, Chief of Compliance.
I think it should be possible to code by using the same trick I used for Guile (which should be already in the CW).
Baral has been coded and added to the CW (and removed from the impossible list). Thanks for the tip!
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse » 03 Feb 2017, 11:39

I'm wondering if Memory Crystal is possible. There are less than 40 cards with colorless costs in their buyback cost and most are similar. I will use Elvish Fury and Evangelize as examples.

For Elvish Fury (and other buyback cards that have colorless mana in their costs), if I add a static ability with a continuous action that is active when the card is in hand and checks the battlefield for the presence of 1 or more instances of Memory Crystal. If it finds 0, it would grant the normal Buyback ability with the full cost of {4}. If it finds 1, it would grant a Buyback ability with a cost of {2}. If it finds more than 1, it would grant a Buyback ability with a cost of {0}.

Obviously, the above would have to be tailored for each card. Evangelize would only ever reduce by {2} at most, so I'd only need the two Buyback abilities with resource IDs. Do you guys see any issues with this approach? Any bad interactions?
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Xander9009 » 03 Feb 2017, 11:41

Perhaps the Dash mechanic would be a simpler method? It checks for a card that reduces dash costs by {2} in the same way.
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse2 » 14 Feb 2017, 14:20

As an approximation for snow costs, could we have a generic cost that checks for an untapped snow land under the owner's control and taps it? Perhaps we could fire a tapped for mana trigger as well?

I am seeing that quite a few of the snow cards are possible given that they are only checking for snow type rather than requiring mana from a snow land.
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby sunds » 13 Mar 2017, 13:00

Hi, I have a request. Please add Karn Liberated (with it's 1st & 2nd ability) and Spellskite (with target spell only), because they are important cards in some special decks and those abilities are enough for fun :)
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby fallenangle » 13 Mar 2017, 14:34

I don't know about Spellskite, but I've been working on Karn Liberated off and on for a couple of years now. His first 2 abilities are no problem to approximate. His third ability can be approximated successfully thanks to a custom mulligan function NeoAnderson wrote for me, with the exception of 2 issues: 1) No one has yet found a way to remove poison counters. The best suggestion I've heard is to register the amount each player has at the time the ultimate is activated, then override any new poison counters until after that number is reached. I am not equal to coding this, and several other talented modders have tried to help me with this issue without success; 2) All extra turns need to be eliminated. I thought that something like Ugin's Nexus would provide a guide for this, but I don't know how to go about making it work. In addition, code would need to be added to every planeswalker with an emblem to remove the emblems when Karn's ultimate is activated. Xander should have my approximated Karn code (most everything that works in it was actually coded by Neo) if anyone wants to give it another shot.
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse » 05 Apr 2017, 20:40

With Amonkhet, Wizards is changing the rules for ALL split cards (not just those added in Amonkhet). I don't think the rules will help us make the cards viable in DOTP2014, but they are worth reading:

http://epicstream.com/news/Amonkhet-Mag ... -Announced

EDIT TO ADD: Thinking about it, I'm wondering if it will make it easier. If I'm understanding the rules correctly, the cards now have all of the traits of both halves when they are not on the stack. They only have individual traits when they are on the stack. We could have each half have its own file and when "it" goes on the stack, the other file could take its place maybe? I don't know. Just thinking out loud. These split cards are a handful.
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Xander9009 » 06 Apr 2017, 03:21

Actually, yeah, this might make it a lot easier. They'll always have both colors, the combined mana cost, things like that.

It never needs to return two values for a single question (e.g. "GetCMC()" can now return "4BG" instead of "2B,2G"). This will mean that any card that calls GetConvertedManaCost will need to be modified to use a CW-specific version, but it might make them possible. The CW's version of the function will need to check if the card has a fake CMC (for any split cards), and if not, then return the normal CMC. The colors will be very simple, and the cardname will be, too (just make the cardname of the example card "DESTINED_TO_LEAD").

The only catch I currently see is what the game will do with a card that has both Instant and Sorcery as types.

Obviously, as you cast it, it'll need to take on the characteristics from one side or the other, and the timing of that might be tricky. Hopefully, however, it can be managed.

EDIT: Actually, thinking about the CMC, might it be possible to simply give it the combined cost as its normal cost, and then give it two alternate costs? Each alternate cost would do the job of checking if it's valid to play that half (targeting and timing) granting the appropriate abilities in time to be made use of properly (much the same way Neo's overload code grants either the non-overloaded ability with targets or the overloaded ability with no targets)? The biggest difference we'd have to use characteristics grabbed from token copies like morph does since we can't dynamically change the cost.
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Re: Impossible Cards (tracking, discussing, etc.)

Postby Splinterverse2 » 06 Apr 2017, 03:30

I was thinking the same thing as you. Full cmc with two activated abilities in hand for older split cards. We should have it prevention normal cast or something. I know these cards would probably not work with things like the Expertise cards, but they would work in most circumstances.

This all sounds maybe above my programming skills. I might need you or someone to do a sample one and then I can proliferate to the others, including the older ones.
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