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Hello, my name is Andrew. One of the reasons I want to get involved in xmage development is my long-term goal of creating an MTGO client based off of xmage that will connect to the official MTGO servers. This is because many people hate the current MTGO client, and an open source version would be really great allowing the community to customize the client to how they like to play. I think there would be a lot more support for xmage (updating card definitions, improving ui etc.) if such a client existed. It would be really cool to customize the client style and having the community constantly improving it. This would not only help the community, but it would help wizards because there would be fewer reimbursements for crashes/bugs, while also maybe gaining more players who were deterred by the client. Tell me what you guys think about it, and if you can/would help.

I hate to be the one to burst your bubble. It would be easier to write a client from scratch.

What you need to know is that the client is ultimately just an interface to show you the state on the server and change it though the API it exposes. Having no documentation on that API or how the server works would imply a tremendous amount of work to reverse engineer it. Also, being something that is not official, after each new release, if there is anything changed in the API, one would need to find it and fix it.

Also, most bugs are not really in the client. At least, they shouldn't be in the client. Being a rules enforced game, the bugs are in the implementation, which ultimately resides on the server. Anything else would mean that I could "hack" my way by saying play this card. Forget that it says "Draw 1 card."; I want it to do "Draw 5 cards.".

This "reimbursements" you talk of are nothing for wizards. I bet you only receive in game stuff. That is FREE for them. The only thing they pay are the support guys who take care of the tickets.

I'm glad you decided to join XMage, even if for the wrong reasons. As long as there is no support from wizards to make your dream true, it will remain just that - a dream. Nevertheless, if you do join the team, you can learn a great deal about programming and the MTG rules. I wish you all the best.

North wrote:I hate to be the one to burst your bubble. It would be easier to write a client from scratch.

What you need to know is that the client is ultimately just an interface to show you the state on the server and change it though the API it exposes. Having no documentation on that API or how the server works would imply a tremendous amount of work to reverse engineer it. Also, being something that is not official, after each new release, if there is anything changed in the API, one would need to find it and fix it.

Also, most bugs are not really in the client. At least, they shouldn't be in the client. Being a rules enforced game, the bugs are in the implementation, which ultimately resides on the server. Anything else would mean that I could "hack" my way by saying play this card. Forget that it says "Draw 1 card."; I want it to do "Draw 5 cards.".

This "reimbursements" you talk of are nothing for wizards. I bet you only receive in game stuff. That is FREE for them. The only thing they pay are the support guys who take care of the tickets.

I'm glad you decided to join XMage, even if for the wrong reasons. As long as there is no support from wizards to make your dream true, it will remain just that - a dream. Nevertheless, if you do join the team, you can learn a great deal about programming and the MTG rules. I wish you all the best.

Oh, I was under the impression that the client enforced the rules then the server checked if it was a valid play. I didn't realize the client itself had no logic in it. I know that this client could be made, as there is software for games that manipulate the packets in other games, which you needed reverse engineer the client for the packets. I was thinking of doing the same thing but instead of a proxy, the client itself, because theoretically the interface would never need to be updated, only the packet information. I still think its very possible, and I still need to learn a lot, and am still interested in joining the development team. Thanks for your response though.
Edit: Also isnt there stuff to decode/grab data from the mtgo client in the xmage project?

Gratin wrote:Edit: Also isnt there stuff to decode/grab data from the mtgo client in the xmage project?

I don't think so. There is no reason to have something like that in xMage.

Validation and logic should always be on the server. Otherwise it will be a recipe for disaster. The client is basically a nice way of interacting with the server.

I can only "reverse engineer" http requests. Everything else seems to complicated for me. If you do find an easy way to do this please do share it because I am interested.

Hello Andrew,

I see it exactly the same way as North.

You welcome to join the Xmage developers, but XMage will never be a (or transform to a) client for MTGO.
Not because I won't like it but because it makes no sense on a technical point of view.

Regards
LevelX2