Bundy wrote:This is the problem i think (or my knowledge of the rules is bad)
1. activate
Elspeth, Knight-Errant and creatures get indestructible.
2. play
Humility and creatures loose indestructible
This is what should happen because
Humility has a later time stamp so it resolves after the emblem of Elspeth.
But if the order is reversed:
1. play
Humility2. activate Elspeth
Now all creatures will loose all abilities, but the emblem should add indestructibility to my creatures since it activated after
Humility was played?
The emblem of
Elspeth, Sun's Champion gives +2/+2, but no flying when played after
HumilityBut the difference is probably in the wording: Creatures you control
get +2/+2 and
have flying. What they
have is taken away by
Humility and what they
get not?
Adding
Humility into the equation is a huge wrench, since it deals with layers. Please make sure to report bugs more fully next time, since it was very unclear that should be a consideration.
Here's an article that talks about
Humility and layers, it is very complex, even for people familiar with the rules.
http://www.gatheringmagic.com/lesson-humility/One major key to layers is timestamps. Not the timestamps of activations though, the timestamps of the host card:
So we have two scenarios:
1.
Humility is on BF, when Elspeth KE ETB.
2. Elspeth is on BF, when
Humility ETB.
Creatures gaining indestructible and creatures losing all abilities both happen at layer 6. That means the timestamp of the host is the order they get handled:
In scenario #1, your creatures should gain Indestructible (after losing all abilities).
In scenario #2, your creatures should very temporarily gain Indestructible, then lose all abilities.
For your second concern, the creatures gain the boost because
Humility setting power toughness happens at layer 1, where the Elspeth SC PT boost happens at layer 7. Again, whether or not Flying is granted is dependant on when
Humility ETB in relation to Elspeth.
There may potentially be issues with that in Forge, but that's how it should work.