DennisBergkamp wrote:Would it matter much though?
As long as we have their cards/rules/art (although downloaded separately) in our game, we're still using their IP and they would still have a case against us.
There's a huge difference between offering the art in the package and offering a system that allows to download it, as the responsibility shifts to the user.(downloading the art of the cards through an automated system is against the T&C of the gatherer website, but it's the responsibility of the user who does it, not the responsibility of the tool, as long as it's clear that the tool is not explicitly using this as a "selling point". In other words, if forge allows you to easily change the server you download the pictures from, it cannot be accused of hammering the servers of gatherer. It's the same for P2P tools. If the p2p tools is advertised as "allowing to download illegal stuff", then they can be involved in terms of responsibility. But if a p2p tool is initially made to do legal stuff, but some people use it for piracy, then the creator of tool is not responsible)
Cards and Rules of MTG are protected by a patent valid only in the USA, in any other country you're pretty much allowed to create a game with the same rules as long as you don't use copyrighted content (art/mana icons/ tap symbols/some names such as "Zendikar").
They also have a design patent on the look and feel of the cards. Basically even if you don't include the "official" art, WotC have protections on the look and feel of their card, and pretty much anything that is generated through MSE cannot be legally distributed. However you have to know that design patents are very restrictive, and changing the look and feel of the cards slightly will make it void. For example moving the P/T to the left of the card, or the top, or stuff like that, renders their patent useless.
I'm talking only from a copyright/patent point of view. By creating a game that reproduces all rules of MTG, you run the risk of being sued for counterfeit, but I believe it is much more difficult for them to go through this and there is no history of wizard doing any kind of legal threat based on "creating a card game that looks an awful lot like theirs"
You can't protect the rules of a game through a patent outside of the USA, as it is considered as an "algorithm", or an "idea", which cannot be patented (except in the US). The rules of a game are still protected by "author's right" in Europe, but WotC's lawyers don't want to go to court, they just want to issue DMCA notices, which they can only do if you break their patents or copyrights.
An other thing, when I got my C&D from WotC, it was obvious that they hadn't run the game even once... never forget that they play a poker game with you. It's cheaper for them to shut you down with a DCMA notice rather than actually making a case against you. I'm not saying you should fight back (you would lose simply because they have more money - yay american justice!), but they might also have sent this DMCA notice while being wrong about it. For example they had youtube delete one of my videos which didn't contain any copyrighted content, just because it contained the word "Wagic" in it, and they didn't bother sorting between the videos that infringed their copyright and those that didn't.
Note how unfair it is: anyone can post videos of MWS with real art, but we get shut down. The reason is because EVERYONE is posting videos of MWS, so they don't have the time/money to close all these videos.
PS: forge, I posted an article on my blog about the notice, I hope it make people think/talk about it:
http://wololo.net/wagic/2009/11/21/wiza ... ans-again/
Posted: 20 Nov 2009, 18:31
