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Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby friarsol » 14 Nov 2016, 20:15

Seravy wrote:I didn't find any information about it, so can someone explain what the various quest options actually do?

Particularly :
-Maximum packs - this seems to be this many packs for each color individually, BUT this many total for specific expansions. Is there a way to change that? As is, color boosters are a whole lot more abundant than packs of specific sets. Which should be the opposite, there are only 5 colors but many many sets.
-Minimum packs - no idea what this does? I bought all 7 packs of one type and after a single game there were 7 again but this is set to 3.
-Wins for pack - same deal, set to 10 but packs went up to 7 in one win.
-Common/Uncommon/Rare singles : set to 7/3/1 but there are way more of each in the shop at any given time.
-Item level restriction : I guess this is the level needed for buying pets and the like maybe? If yes, is it the number of levels you need to unlock 1 level on items or, the number of item levels unlocked for each one of your levels? What qualifies as an item anyway? Are pets included? Or only stuff like the shop discount?
-Wins per draft rotation : Again no idea what this does. Tried changing it to 5 but the draft available did not change after playing 5 matches.
-Wins for new draft : Set to 10 but if I play 10 games with one draft already available, I do not get a second one, it replaces the first. If I don't have one, I gain a new one though. I remember having multiple drafts when I didn't play one for a long time in another game so I have no idea how that happens but it's possible.
-No option for number of booster boxes and starter decks in shop? Or does that depend on booster settings too?
The first 4 all have to do with the contents of the packs that the spell shop "opens" to create its inventory.. Basically, Quest Mode has two different influences on how many packs are opened, how many wins you have and how low of a rank you are. The idea is to balance things so early on you get a certain amount of packs and that number fluctuates, but never lower than the minimum or higher than the maximum. The Rarity is what the distribution is for these packs.

Each time a match is completed the spell shop resets.

Item level restriction currently is only for pets, but was described generically to be used for other things. Basically it means you can't buy a rank of a pet higher than your current quest rank thus slowing how quickly you can improve your pets in game.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby Seravy » 14 Nov 2016, 21:05

So if I understand this well, the settings I have mean every time I finish a match, the shop clears its inventory then adds 3 (min packs) to 7 (max packs)rares, 3*(3 to 7) =9-21 uncommons, and 7*(3 to 7) = 21-49 commons?
So having 7 unopened pack of everything each time is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with "max packs"? Nor does having 3 booster boxes and 4 starter decks every time has anything to do with any of the above?
But then what is "wins for pack" for when it's actually opened after every win anyway? Or does that one mean the shop actually opens (min packs+wins/(win per pack)) to (max packs+wins/(win per pack) instead? So if it's set to 10 and I have 30 wins then I get 6-10 packs (+3 over the default) worth of single cards in the shop and this keeps growing as I get more wins by one every 10 wins?
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby timmermac » 14 Nov 2016, 23:01

I believe (and anybody can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here) that SHOP_WINS_FOR_ADDITIONAL_PACK refers to increasing the number of unopened packs of each type in the shop. I have my starting packs set to 1 with it set to increase every 10 wins. So, after 10 wins, there will be 2 unopened boxes taken randomly from those sets that have booster boxes, 2 unopened packs of each color,2 booster packs taken randomly..., 2 fatpacks taken randomly..., and 2 starters taken randomly... And that amount keeps going up by 1 every 10 wins, I think until it hits the maximum packs value, but don't quote me on that.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby Seravy » 14 Nov 2016, 23:52

timmermac wrote:I believe (and anybody can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here) that SHOP_WINS_FOR_ADDITIONAL_PACK refers to increasing the number of unopened packs of each type in the shop. I have my starting packs set to 1 with it set to increase every 10 wins. So, after 10 wins, there will be 2 unopened boxes taken randomly from those sets that have booster boxes, 2 unopened packs of each color,2 booster packs taken randomly..., 2 fatpacks taken randomly..., and 2 starters taken randomly... And that amount keeps going up by 1 every 10 wins, I think until it hits the maximum packs value, but don't quote me on that.
With 380 wins I have
-3 booster boxes
-4 starter decks
-7 Preconstructed decks
-7 of each colored booster
-7 boosters total from actual sets
-7 rare single cards
-21 uncommons
-didn't count but I assume I should have 49 commons.

and my max boosters is set to 7. So aside from boxes and decks the rest seems to be set through "max packs".
Also, I haven't yet started selling cards because the sale price is still not maxed, at this rate I estimate I need 800 wins total before I can do that...so that's when the amount of boosters for sale start to matter first, otherwise there is no way to afford more than one pack per match (unless ofc if I don't spend my money immediately). As is I fail to see the point of this system, by the time you can afford multiple packs per game (if that EVER happens), you'll have it maxed anyway. (unless you set packs per win to something like several hundreds)
I suppose it was designed for the broken price system I no longer use. Sure if you can sell a single lotus for a million then the number of packs for sale suddenly matter. But if the most expensive rare sells for 2k, not so much.
Still don't know what the difference between minimal and starting packs is either. Nor the "wins for tournament rotation" etc.
Ehhh whatever. Instead of these, isn't there some hidden option to alter shop selling %? I've been grinding wins up for over a week now (and I'm using a fast deck on easy opponents to speed it up for most of my games which is not very fun) and still only halfway there to maxing it out. By the time I actually reach 100% or whichever the highest price is, I'll have like, several dozen booster boxes worth of unsold stuff if not hundreds, especially as I tend to draft for money most of the time too. (and surprisingly, win about half the time despite that)
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby timmermac » 15 Nov 2016, 01:20

Not so much for shop percentage, but I set my starting credits to 500 million and also up the credits per win to where I'm usually raking in 3 million credits per win.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby vinnie » 15 Nov 2016, 19:55

friarsol wrote:Rarity is what the distribution is for these packs.
I think it is wrong, I think the distribution in these packs is the "boosterpack ratio", while "Common/Uncommon/Rare singles" refers to the single cards in spell shop.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby friarsol » 15 Nov 2016, 20:38

vinnie wrote:
friarsol wrote:Rarity is what the distribution is for these packs.
I think it is wrong, I think the distribution in these packs is the "boosterpack ratio", while "Common/Uncommon/Rare singles" refers to the single cards in spell shop.
You are saying that I'm wrong but you are agreeing with what I'm talking about. I was specifically talking about the "Packs" that are opened to make the spell shop inventory.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby vinnie » 15 Nov 2016, 21:29

Yep, boosterpack ratio is exactly what you said If you're referring to the cards inside a boosterpack.
Of course if for packs you intend all the single cards of the shop, then it's easy to get confused with an buyable "booster pack".
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby friarsol » 15 Nov 2016, 21:54

vinnie wrote:Yep, boosterpack ratio is exactly what you said If you're referring to the cards inside a boosterpack.
Of course if for packs you intend all the single cards of the shop, then it's easy to get confused with an buyable "booster pack".
Literally my first sentence said that "The first 4 all have to do with the contents of the packs that the spell shop "opens" to create its inventory."
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby vinnie » 16 Nov 2016, 13:22

sorry but with "first 4" the thing isn't very well understood.
If you mean the first 4 entries in preferences where appear the words "common, uncommon and rare", you're right.
But if you mean the first 4 items listed by seravy (that is 1-Maximum packs, 2-Minimum packs, 3-Wins for pack 4-Common/Uncommon/Rare singles), the fourth entry refers to the number of single cards of that rarity in the shop, not the ratio in a booster pack. The discriminant is the word "singles".

If with "The first 4 all have to do with the contents of the packs that the spell shop "opens""
you mean that the shop virtually "opens" a packages to provide single cards, it might be ok, but at this point the first 3 entries refer to booster pack and not to individual cards and therefore cannot be put together saying "first 4".
However I'm not very good with English, so it is very probable that I have misunderstood.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby friarsol » 16 Nov 2016, 13:39

vinnie wrote:If with "The first 4 all have to do with the contents of the packs that the spell shop "opens""
you mean that the shop virtually "opens" a packages to provide single cards, it might be ok, but at this point the first 3 entries refer to booster pack and not to individual cards and therefore cannot be put together saying "first 4".
However I'm not very good with English, so it is very probable that I have misunderstood.
Yes. The first 3 things are about how many virtual packs are opened, and the 4th is about what comes out of those packs. How many packs and what is in those packs combine to be the contents of those packs.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby vinnie » 16 Nov 2016, 14:16

Ok, I try to do two examples which help me to understand this dynamic:
1)I set maximum/minimum/starting pack all to 3 and Common/Uncommon/Rare singles all to 1; by what method the cards are extracted from those packages;
and having more cards to select, how changed the result?
2)I set maximum/minimum/starting pack all to 1 and Common/Uncommon/Rare singles all to 100; How can they be extracted more cards than available in packages?
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby friarsol » 16 Nov 2016, 15:05

vinnie wrote:Ok, I try to do two examples which help me to understand this dynamic:
1)I set maximum/minimum/starting pack all to 3 and Common/Uncommon/Rare singles all to 1; by what method the cards are extracted from those packages;
and having more cards to select, how changed the result?
2)I set maximum/minimum/starting pack all to 1 and Common/Uncommon/Rare singles all to 100; How can they be extracted more cards than available in packages?
Basically there's a formula that says

N packs * R rarity = # cards of that rarity. If Max and Min are always the same number there's no noticeable changes that happen. So you can get the exact same rarity distribution of a spell shop by doing 5 packs * 12 rarity vs 6 packs * 10 rarity.


And to follow up, all of the unopened product in the store is the same as the amount of virtual boosters that are opened:

Here's the code for "generateCardsInShop()":

Code: Select all
        final int startPacks = this.qpref.getPrefInt(QPref.SHOP_STARTING_PACKS);
        final int winsForPack = this.qpref.getPrefInt(QPref.SHOP_WINS_FOR_ADDITIONAL_PACK);
        final int maxPacks = this.qpref.getPrefInt(QPref.SHOP_MAX_PACKS);
        final int minPacks = this.qpref.getPrefInt(QPref.SHOP_MIN_PACKS);

        int level = this.qc.getAchievements().getLevel();
        final int levelPacks = level > 0 ? startPacks / level : startPacks;
        final int winPacks = this.qc.getAchievements().getWin() / winsForPack;
        final int totalPacks = Math.min(Math.max(levelPacks + winPacks, minPacks), maxPacks);

        SealedProduct.Template tpl = getShopBoosterTemplate();
        UnOpenedProduct unopened = qc.getFormat() == null ?  new UnOpenedProduct(tpl) : new UnOpenedProduct(tpl, qc.getFormat().getFilterPrinted());

        for (int i = 0; i < totalPacks; i++) {
            this.qa.getShopList().addAllOfTypeFlat(unopened.get());
        }

        this.generateBoostersInShop(totalPacks);
        this.generatePreconsInShop(totalPacks);
        this.generateTournamentsInShop(totalPacks);
        this.generateFatPacksInShop(totalPacks);
        this.generateBoosterBoxesInShop(totalPacks);
Which translates roughly to:

Take the amount of starting packs and divide it by your level. "S"
Take the amount of wins and divide it by the amount of wins per pack. "W"
Add S and W, then take the larger between this and minpacks. "M"
Take smaller between M and maxpacks. "N"

Generate a virtual booster template for your quest settings. (Including rarity for the spell shop singles)
Create N virtual opened boosters for inventory based on that template..
Create N unopened boosters.
Create N Preconstructed decks.
Create N Tournament Packs.
Create N Fat packs.
Create N Booster boxes.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby Seravy » 16 Nov 2016, 16:20

"Create N Booster boxes."
Not sure if this one works, I always see 3 booster boxes, despite my N being 7 (and I get 7 of everything else)

"Create N Tournament Packs."
Same here, I have 5 right now, but usually had 4 for a long while.

"Create N unopened boosters."
It actually creates 7 times N boosters, N for each type among :
-colorless pack
-red pack
-green pack
-blue pack
-black pack
-white pack
-actual mtg expansion packs (such as 6th edition or urza's saga or whatever)
It would be better if there was a way to separate these. When you have many sets unlocked, color packs will be pretty useless in finding specific cards...but with only N set packs from the entire format, the chance of having the right set even available, let alone more than once, is minimal. Or I could say, having 6N color packs and only N set packs is a bad ratio. I suppose the workaround is to buy booster boxes when the correct set pops up, but that assumes the player is able and willing to save enough money to buy 36 packs at once.
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Re: Quest Mode: Guide to Formats, Worlds, and everything

Postby friarsol » 16 Nov 2016, 16:32

I didn't really look into the specific logic of each generate call.

What N is a seed for how many they are not necessarily that amount (Like for example booster boxes is packs / 2 or the total number of editions, whichever is less.)
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