Challenges... my point of view

[baka]

I have played a lot the Challenges and I just think its too difficult.
Why make it so hard? I can not understand!
Why do we need to build a "perfect" deck to beat just one challenge?
This will make everything about creating a "beat-the-challenge" deck,
using the most optimal cards and living out almost 95% of the other cards.
is it not creating new and fun decks what makes magic fun?
yes, i think some challenges should be "hard", but damn, not every single one!
i just hate to use some cards, because they just about winning "fast", nothing
else. theres no fun about that!
when i play some challenges i can see that ai is all about winning fast and nasty.
no mercy att all. using optimal settings.
i think the challenges should have different difficulty, otherwise all of us
will just be a bunch of crazy-beat-all-deck-builders. only looking for the best card
and leaving out the "bad" ones.
speak up your mind!

[stassy]

Due to the basic ai you don't have many choices when creating a "challenge":
- Either make ai cheats by giving him card advantage/life/mana
- Restrict the player with card disadvantage/life/mana
- Restrict the player with a winning requirement

In all case the player deck need to be as efficient as possible because if uber geared the ai will not "play nice" and always aim at killing the player asap.

That doesn't mean the player deck is restricted to one only winning deck, as you can see in the spoiler thread you may use several type of deck to win except in special cases.

[Dave]

The AI doesn't have to play 'nice', because the Challenges-difficulty should be .., well, ... challenging. All of them, otherwise it should be named '10 in a row' instead of 'Challenges'.
I think the challenges are versatile, because by applying AI-advantage/player-restrictions, I was forced to learn dredge- (easy) and tendrils-decks (difficult but rewarding), which i wasn't familiar with untill then. Apparently they are educational as well...
A lot of the (early) challenges can be beaten with some dumb but fast Oath-deck. No difficulty there, especially with cards from the later expansions.
When they seem too difficult, just browse this forum for ideas. I , for one, found that very helpfull in some cases.
When i want to experiment with a ludicrous deck, i expect to lose against well-build decks or decks which start with an advantage, hence the term 'Challenge'. For those decks : uncheck Challenge-checkbox and have fun.

[juzamjedi]

I will agree, the AI is pretty bad overall so the Challenge series is a nice way for people to... have more of a challenge

I honestly feel that the deck building challenges that restrict what can go in your deck are really cool. Gather No Moss, Dude, That's Big, Enchanted Evening, March of the Machines, etc. force you to build weird decks that you might not play otherwise.

I am guessing you feel this way because some of the cards are locked that you want to play. If that's true then seek help in the forums for the challenge(s) that you really want to beat.

[baka]

well, i have played so much that im getting pissed off,
after building lots of different decks and testing over and over,
playing hours to just die somewhere in the challenge, its frustrating!
or the numerous times the game crashes after you believe, now i get u your *** computer...
and yes, i have tried tendrils, even if i dont like that method is effective,
but come one, why use a system that is not about playing anymore, is like
a mono playing game, not a duel anymore.

i think the challenge is great, very nice indeed, i like the idea, but come one!
at least make it more friendly, where you can start from where you die, so you
dont need to do everything over and over and over and over....

[aww1979]

...at least make it more friendly, where you can start from where you die, so you
dont need to do everything over and over and over and over....

If Jatill did it that way, it would take zero skill to beat the challenges because it would become 'win 10 games, even if you lose 10000000 games in between'. I like the challenges because it provides a way for the game to be good even with a dumb AI. I don't even use the Microprose program anymore except for challenges, shandalar, or occasionally sealed deck, because it's boring winning 20-30 games in a row with a mediocre deck. Challenge mode means you need to be able to build good decks, play well, and judge the challenge metagame to know what is most effective. (i.e. something like Time Walk is no good on the "Perfect Storm" challenge)

[thedrigo]

...at least make it more friendly, where you can start from where you die, so you
dont need to do everything over and over and over and over....

If Jatill did it that way, it would take zero skill to beat the challenges because it would become 'win 10 games, even if you lose 10000000 games in between'. I like the challenges because it provides a way for the game to be good even with a dumb AI. I don't even use the Microprose program anymore except for challenges, shandalar, or occasionally sealed deck, because it's boring winning 20-30 games in a row with a mediocre deck. Challenge mode means you need to be able to build good decks, play well, and judge the challenge metagame to know what is most effective. (i.e. something like Time Walk is no good on the "Perfect Storm" challenge)

I could not have said it better myself!

[BAgate]

This is one of the problems I have with game design today. You think challenges make it fun, so there are challenges. The OP thinks the game would be more fun without challenges (which I agree with). So why not keep the challenges for those who want them, but unlock all the cards so people who don't want the aggravation (or challenge if you want to call it that) can play that way? Why is there this obsession of IT MUST BE MY WAY? Why can't it be both ways so that the maximum number of people can get the maximum enjoyment. Isn't that the point of games?

[baka]

i agree with you BAgate and i think your suggestion is good
the locked cards should be there for those who wants it but as an option

it have been a while since i posted anything and during that time i have played quite a lot
won 1 challenge so far, the only land challenge, to unlock one card that i needed, and even if i got the message, the card didnt unlock anyway.. lol..

the success rate is terrible and its not fun at all. i have tried to complete the set #1 challenges
i have stopped trying to win any challenges, i just make different decks, just to try them out,
but against the ai that wins in a couple of turns, its not that easy.
and i have tried to use oath, tendrils, dredge and angel and i manage to win once after many attempt (in version 2)
i also tried it in version 3 but failed, the decks are so boring that its not fun to play.
magic is about making decks, the challenges is not about that, its to make killer decks that are boring to play. i dont believe the creators of magic intended this way. thats why they ban/restrict cards, to not spoil the game.

also a suggestion, if the challenges are made to use 1 or maximum 2 different decks, why not include them as default deck when doing challenges, what the point on doing on our own if theres only 1 solution?

[baka]

and after so many attempts to beat challenge 1-1 tribal trial with different strategies i surrendered myself and i go with the so boring but yet so effective oath-deck with emrakul (and some modifications) and i win the challenge...