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Jan Tournament - Single Set Audtion

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Jan Tournament - Single Set Audtion

Postby jatill » 03 Dec 2010, 13:04

Remember single set constructed? This tournament is similar, but with a twist. We will each bid on which set we get to use. Also, you can only use 1 copy of any given card (excluding Fallen Empires/Antiquities, which can use 1 copy per art in the original set).
The auction for each set will start at 8 cards and 30 life, which is what the player will start each game at. You can win a set by bidding lower. Going down cards always beats life, so 6 cards and 30 life is less than 7 cards and 1 life. These are the sets we will be using:

Beta
Arabian Nights
Antiquities
Fallen Empires
Legends
8th Edition
Zendikar
M11

Group A:
Shantak
Aww
jatill
240sxForever

Group B:
Salbei
Aswan Jaguar
Monopoman
juzamjedi
Last edited by jatill on 04 Jan 2011, 13:48, edited 9 times in total.
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion

Postby aww1979 » 03 Dec 2010, 19:16

I'll play, though I have no idea how the auction is going to work :p
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion

Postby Salbei » 04 Dec 2010, 09:17

Hmm i just opened the Deckeditor and made only Antiquities card appear... there are only like 4 cards per color and 75% of them i wouldn´t even put into a deck even if i would get paid for it.
Limiting that to 1 copy force you to play with 40 cards (with like 50% lands if not more). Workshop + Triskelion + Mishras Factory are like the only non-complete-shitty cards in there.Compare them to the Beta spoilers or a Baneslayer Angel then even they start to look bad.
4 Shops + 4 Trisks and you could at least fill a 60 card deck along with some semi-terrible cards.

Pretty much the same thing with Homelands - just even less playable cards (Hymn to Tourach and ... yeah thats it) but at least the minimum of synergies.I wouldn´t even pick Homelands if i could start with 50 life.

I´m fine with the auction system, but the 1-off rule just won´t work out. Imo you should allow the weaker sets more copies to "balance" things out. Or lower the decksize to 40

Powerlevel Predictions:

3 "strong" //2 copies (60 cards) // 1 copy (40 cards) // alterative idea: min decksize 80
Zendikar
M11
Beta (obviously only 1 copy of the restricted cards)

3 "mediocore" // 3 copies (60 cards) // 2 copies (40 cards) // alternative idea : min decksize 60
Antiquities
Arabian Nights
8th Edition

2 "weak" // 4 copies (60 cards) // 1 copy (40 cards) // alternative idea : min decksize 40
Legends
Homelands

Just a suggestion.
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion

Postby 240sxforever » 04 Dec 2010, 16:25

I will play in this one, most of the month is winter break.
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion

Postby juzamjedi » 04 Dec 2010, 23:08

I bid 8 cards 15 life for Beta
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion

Postby aww1979 » 05 Dec 2010, 01:13

Can I bid on several sets at once?
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion

Postby jatill » 05 Dec 2010, 06:31

aww1979 wrote:Can I bid on several sets at once?
No. I'll go over the bidding rules once we have 8 players.

Salbei and juzamjedi, are you in?
Salbei- it's going to stay singleton. Antiquities might not have a lot to offer, but you can probably get it for the full 8 cards, 30 life. If you want to not get stuck with it, make sure you win another bid!
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion - sign up now!

Postby Shantak » 05 Dec 2010, 08:53

Sounds interesting, I'm in. How are you going to implement a different deck having a different amount of life and cards in hand?
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion - sign up now!

Postby Salbei » 05 Dec 2010, 09:15

There is no need to implement it. Just use the debug mode to adjust handsize and lifepoints.Not sure if there is a fair way to let the AI discard cards though.

---

What about the minimum decksize ? 40 or 60 cards ?
60 cards + Singleton seems to be insane for some sets.
Antiquities for example got 85 cards total.

I´ve tried to build a few decks to get a feeling for the format.
Antiquities was relative easy to get a 40 card deck together for it (although i had to fill with like 8 crappy cards).
I spend almost an hour to create a 40 card deck from "Legends" and failed - i´ll have mad respect for the person who can do it.Well artifacts all over the place.
Beta was easy. Restricted list + duals and your done ^^
Then i tried a few different decks for 8th edition, wasn´t that happy with any of the decks but its definatly possible to build a mediocore deck with it.blue got surprisingly good cards in there and will most likly be played.

About the artwork rule:
That special rule allows you to play 4 Strip Mines, Urzatron and also 4 Mishras Factories in Antiquities (all got 4 different artworks).Thats neat.

My testruns so far have been really onesided . Beta crushed Antiquities and 8th - well both with the normal handsize and life, but i guess that if you want to play Beta you really have to pay for it.
Antiquities steamrolled my 8th edition deck and the 8th edition couldn´t beat anything so far (could really need cruel edict and others cards that aren´t coded).
Still testing the format and am using 40 card decks for those tests, i can´t imagine to play 60 card decks with some editions.

The auction system gonna make it interesting.Also note that the normal deckbuilder doesn´t show all cards when you use the filter - you have to check on the internet what cards are actually in there.Jatills doesn´t work for me so i have to do it the old fashioned way.

And yeah, i´d like to play.

The auction should be limited somehow (i bid 6 cards 20 life on everything, even if i don´t want to play those sets. duh!).Well you already mentioned you aren´t able to do that.
Beeing able to play with the maximum cards and life for willingly choosing a "weaker set" should be a strategic option.
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion - sign up now!

Postby monopoman » 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

I will play in this also I remember a similar format being used in one of the invitationals back in the day.

That one was a bid for like 20 different decks that won nationals or something and you had to bid life/cards to get each one.
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion - sign up now-2

Postby jatill » 06 Dec 2010, 21:00

salbei-
Since you've thought about potential decks a little, would you recommend 40 or 60 card deck minimums?
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion - sign up now-2

Postby 240sxforever » 06 Dec 2010, 21:16

Will there be a separate version of the game issued for this, or will we just use what we have? I have never used the limited functions of the game, only constructed.
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion - sign up now-2

Postby juzamjedi » 06 Dec 2010, 21:37

Yes, I am interested in playing. That was why I made my first bid ;)

The sets are very different in power level, but hopefully the people will bid appropriately. If we are drafting one set at a time then the auction order we use will make a big difference on how the bidding goes. The most powerful sets probably need to bid first to make sure we have lots of competition for the best cards.
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion - sign up now-2

Postby Salbei » 07 Dec 2010, 01:39

jatill wrote:salbei-
Since you've thought about potential decks a little, would you recommend 40 or 60 card deck minimums?
Some implemented Sets got less than 90 cards and going for a 60 card deck with those sets is going to be extremly difficult when only 1 copy per card is allowed.Most of the time this forces you to play 3 or 4 colors without any access to manafixers.Having to play a 3+ color deck just with basiclands is really going to hurt the gameflow (lots and lots of manascrew).

Most of those issues are going to be fixed with 40 card minimum decks.
The games are going to be shorter that way since the general card quality is going to be a lot higher and also decking out becomes a strategic factor again and generally more fun to play.Beta is going to be even more powerfull with the duals, moxen and restricted cards in a 40 card deck, but thats what the auction is going to take care off.Hopefully a high "automulligan" is going to weaken the set enough.

Like i´ve said i would highly suggest using a minimum of 40 cards.

Here are links to visual card spoilers for each set:

Beta (302 cards, 46 cards per color)-> http://www.magicdeckvortex.com/VS_beta.htm
Arabian Nights (78 cards,11 cards per color) -> http://www.magicdeckvortex.com/VS_arabian_nights.htm
Antiquities (100? cards, 7 cards per color) -> http://www.magicdeckvortex.com/VS_antiquities.htm
Fallen Empires (187 cards, 16 cards per color) -> http://www.magicdeckvortex.com/VS_fallen_empires.htm
Legends (310 cards, 43 cards per color) -> http://www.magicdeckvortex.com/VS_legends.htm
8th Edition (365 cards, ~60 cards per color) -> http://www.magicdeckvortex.com/VS_Eighth_Edition.htm
Zendikar (249 cards, 39 cards per color) -> http://www.magicdeckvortex.com/VS_zendikar.htm
M10 (249 cards, 41 cards per color) -> http://www.magicdeckvortex.com/VS_m10_core.htm

Note: not all of the shown cards are actually implemented

You can clearly see that Arabian Nights, Antiquities and Fallen Empires get the short end of the stick.You are pretty much forced to play 3 colors in those sets even with a 40 card deck.
Building a 60 card deck in those sets is an almost impossible task.

I tried to build a deck for each set to playtest.In the normal (constructed) version i don´t have access to a lot of Zendikar and Fallen Empire cards so i guess we are using the Sealed deck (limited) version to play, right ?
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Re: January Tournament - Single Set Audtion - 1 spot left!

Postby jatill » 07 Dec 2010, 13:13

40 cards it is, and yes, we will use the limited version.
We have 1 more slot open, and once that is filled, the auction will begin. Here are the rules I'm thinking of. Let me know if you have any objections:

I'll list all 8 sets and their current bids (none to start with). Then, if you are not already winning any bid, you can make a lower bid on any set. If you are already bidding on a set, you cannot bid on another set until you are outbid. After 12 hours or so have passed and no new bids are made, the auction is over. If any sets still have no bids, then they are distributed at random among the people without a winning bid.
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