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Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

MicroProse's Shandalar Campaign Game, now with new cards & a new look!

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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby Fourth Inversion » 20 Jul 2015, 10:40

I made this Marduish (BWR) Warrior deck featuring Zurgo Helmsmasher... only to realise that this colour combination isn't in Shandalar, as there's no white Djinn. Maybe it could work for the War Mage (with a bit of a power upgrade, cutting junk like Tor Wauki etc.) and slightly more emphasis on red?
| Open
.14437 3 Zurgo Helmsmasher
.13370 3 Akroan Hoplite
.1337 2 Blightning
.14241 3 Chief of the Edge
.14242 3 Chief of the Scale
.9977 3 Goblin Deathraiders
.1328 2 Lightning Helix
.14321 2 Mardu Roughrider
.14420 3 Utter End
.820 1 Tor Wauki
.13227 2 Spike Jester
.3704 2 Bedlam
.1604 2 Fervor
.11704 1 Urabrask the Hidden
.282 1 Wheel of Fortune
.14338 4 Nomad Outpost
.9 2 Badlands
.189 2 Plateau
.216 2 Scrubland
.164 4 Mountain
.239 5 Swamp
.188 4 Plains
.6 1 Armageddon
.966 2 Glorious Anthem
.167 1 Mox Pearl
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby stassy » 06 Aug 2015, 07:51

Tribal Drake for Sea Dragon, now to make the AI sac more often its drake to stay alive would be nice (will report it but seems to be AI can't sac counter more than once per turn even if it's still in AI favor)

Sea Dragon 0218.dck
| Open
.13331 4 Seacoast Drake
.1155 4 Spiketail Hatchling
.8673 4 Spiketail Drakeling
.4893 4 Spiketail Drake
.12626 4 Talrand, Sky Summoner
.12368 4 Favorable Winds
.1078 4 Mana Leak
.10670 4 Spell Pierce
.7030 2 Condescend
.12627 4 Talrand's Invocation
.10773 4 Halimar Depths
.126 18 Island
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby stassy » 08 Aug 2015, 05:07

RG Turbo-ish Titan deck for Green Boss, it's missing the true creature picker like Summoning Trap or big mana generator per Eldrazi Ramp style archetype, I wanted something to replace Gaea's Liege signature card so here it is.

Burgeoning + default bonus Sylvan Library + Starting life at 35 make it for the card/mana turbo, but AI still draw more than it can use and discard a lot at T1-T3, too bad...(and noticed also a damage stacking bug)

Morgane, the Great Druid 0095.dck
| Open
.11162 4 Primeval Titan
.1469 4 Sakura-Tribe Elder
.10726 3 Avenger of Zendikar
.1468 4 Terramorphic Expanse
.10925 4 Evolving Wilds
.164 11 Mountain
.10700 4 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
.1124 4 Rampant Growth
.11110 4 Cultivate
.3344 2 Burgeoning
.10730 1 Bestial Menace
.4394 2 Bifurcate
.91 4 Forest
.11134 4 Inferno Titan
.13798 1 Scouring Sands
.4319 2 Rolling Earthquake
.8569 2 Greenseeker
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby stassy » 11 Aug 2015, 11:26

Because a Great Druid deck without druid is just meh, here is a Tribal-ish elf deck that gather druid to summon some big earth avatar :

Morgane, the Great Druid 2 0095.dck
| Open
.13594 3 Voyaging Satyr
.10413 4 Elvish Archdruid
.11120 4 Fauna Shaman
.9362 1 Gilt-Leaf Archdruid
.9366 4 Heritage Druid
.13284 4 Elvish Mystic
.9831 4 Nettle Sentinel
.10039 3 Ranger of Eos
.9854 2 Regal Force
.10802 2 Nature's Claim
.10170 3 Mark of Asylum
.12807 1 Rootborn Defenses
.91 5 Forest
.11345 4 Razorverge Thicket
.10476 1 Sunpetal Grove
.1468 4 Terramorphic Expanse
.10925 2 Evolving Wilds
.13821 1 Temple of Plenty
.1463 2 Eladamri, Lord of Leaves
.6129 4 Elvish Vanguard
.9178 2 Immaculate Magistrate


The boss fare a bit better than his druidless version on earlier stages when getting a good starting hand at T3, however there are still issues that will be forwarded in the Bug Tracker:
- Because of his starting life of 35 hp, he still misuse Sylvan Library and will flood his hand and discard cards at T1, same for Regal Force at later turn, AI doesn't check if his library will be emptied by casting it.
- Voyaging Satyr feels like untapping land when he want for no reason, and end of turn of whatever.
- Fauna Shaman sometimes discard Regal Force for Nettle Sentinel
- Heritage Druid ability is never used
- Immaculate Magistrate mostly use its ability as interrupt step or sweep step, which could be a clever move but only on creature about to die by some damages, and it didn't and would always activate on combat damage Giant Growth style

Included in the archive a savegame that pop the player directly in front of Green Castle (you still have to go through the dungeon in order to test him, but F12+W will do the trick), also you still have a crappy burn deck so use Ciroth tool to edit it.
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby rodil » 12 Aug 2015, 12:08

Hi, I've made a full set of enemy decks. I'm finally happy with the results after a lot of testing. Balance is impossible so I just tried to make the decks interesting and attack from a lot of different angles. Some of the decks the computer is BAD with(stupid computer).

There may be some broken cards, I used Thieves Hideout 1 August 3rd card set. I know for sure the smoke bug will effect the Centaur Warcheif deck and sometimes the elf deck crashes, haven't figured out why.

Here are the rules I used to make the decks:
| Open
(I categorized the enemies by how much life they start with at the beginning of the game, I may not have all the names exactly right)

abbreviations: C: common, U:Uncommon, R:Rare, M:Mythic, P:Power

Level 1: witch, seer, sorceress, druid, cleric
Goal: sampling of things in color, easy, should be inconsistent, different every time. Like a bad draft deck
Rules: max U7, R2, max of each individual card: 1xR/U/C.

Level 2: undead knight, elvish magi, merfolk shaman, sorcerer, priestess
Goal: themed, still inconsistent, still fairly easy for beginning decks. Like a decent draft deck.
Rules: max U15, R5, max of each individual card: 2xU/C, 1xR.

Level 3: warlock, conjurer, troll shaman, enchantress, crusader
Goal: getting more challenging, like a bad standard deck.
Rules: Max: R7, M2, max of each individual card: 3xC,2xU,1xR

Level 4: elementalist, sedge beast, fungus master, mind stealer, tusked guardian
Goal: same range of challenge as 3, small step up, like a good standard deck
Rules: Max: R10, M5, max of each individual card: 3xUC, 2xR, 1xM

Level 5: sea dragon, vampire lord, forest dragon, goblin warlord, paladin
Goal: same range of challenge as 4, small step up, like a bad modern deck
Rules: Max: R15, M7, max of each individual card: 4xC 3xU, 2xMR

Level 6: altakesh, aga galneer, queltosh, saltrem tor
Goal: same range of challenge as 5, small step up, like a good modern deck
Rules: Max: M10, max of each individual card: 4xUC, 3xR, 2xM

Level 7: lord of fate, winged stallion, centaur shaman, ape lord, centaur warchief, shapeshifter, archangel, hydra, nether fiend, beastmaster
Goals: small step up, like a bad legacy deck(some of these are not as good as the level 6 ones, but those ones tend to attack from odd angles or have lockout cards that can just win the game if you are not prepared.)
Rules: no maxes, max of each individual card: 4xUC, 3xMR

Level 8: summoner, high priest, war mage, thought invoker, necromancer
Goals: Didn't want these to be super hard since you can't buy your way out of fighting them, but still challenging enough to fear. Still in the bad legacy deck range
Rules: allow 1 Power, max of each individual card: 4xUCMR

Level 9: mandurung, whim, prismat, dracur, kiskara
Goals: hard, can buy way out of fighting, did best I could with cards available using all 3 colors, some are good, some are mediocre.
Rules: allow 5 Power, max of each individual card: 4xUCMRP

Level 10: castle bosses
Goals: mono colored mastery, did best I could with cards in one color to make most challenging bosses, you only fight these guys once
Rules: allow 10 power, max of each individual card: 4xUCMRP

Level 11: End Boss
Goals: HARD 5 color tall stack(least tested deck so I don't know how successful I was)
Rules: max of each individual card: 4xUCMRP

I also wanted to shout out a thanks to the rest of you who are making and posting decks as they are interesting, fun and great to steal ideas from. :)

If anybody can figure out a decklist for the computer use turbofog correctly(not casting fog on their turn) I would love to see it.

Sorry for not listing out all the decks. I want to get back to playing. :D
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby jiansonz » 13 Aug 2015, 07:41

rodil, thanks a lot for your awesome contribution. I especially like your choice to make the smaller enemy decks not so competitive, and gradually build them up as you go through the enemy tiers.
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby stassy » 13 Aug 2015, 10:46

Just for the heck of it, I tested a basic turbofog deck...and AI indeed cast randomly fog card and game crashed :cry:

| Open
.411 4 Drop of Honey
.88 4 Fog
.1496 2 Final Judgment
.672 4 Holy Day
.710 2 Land Tax
.290 4 Wrath of God
.1599 4 Font of Mythos
.114 4 Howling Mine
.503 4 Ivory Tower
.507 4 Millstone
.165 1 Mox Emerald
.167 1 Mox Pearl
.212 4 Savannah
.1498 4 Temple Garden
.1472 4 Windswept Heath
.91 5 Forest
.188 5 Plains


Will have to report it, and I will check for other typical fog deck in order to see if it's card specific or AI behavior specific, for now here is an archived 19 Mo AI log zipped up to 190 Ko from the last duel crash.
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby stassy » 13 Aug 2015, 13:12

Well, after several test, I can safely assume that those cards from this deck do not crash the game and are correctly played, except Safe Passage which is randomly cast and its victory condition which has an issue but make it a total OP deck :mrgreen:

| Open
.11565 4 Beast Within
.11216 2 Blunt the Assault
.12153 4 Clinging Mists
.88 3 Fog
.10462 4 Safe Passage
.91 14 Forest
.188 3 Plains
.10190 2 Reliquary Tower
.10476 4 Sunpetal Grove
.12613 4 Sands of Delirium
.9740 4 Batwing Brume
.5140 2 Tangle
.1599 4 Font of Mythos
.13421 4 Defend the Hearth
.4391 1 Bargaining Table
.1248 1 Heartbeat of Spring


If there are more than one Sands of Delirium in bf, the AI can activate all of them at once for only X (instead of each activation for X), which make it a miller killer, I wondered why I did lose from milling so fast :lol:

This turbofog is missing key cards like Rites of Flourishing or Witchbane Orb in order to be truly dangerous, and I don't know which enemy would fit it (maybe druid or enchantress?)

Also got this weird message when dying through milling, not sure if that must be forwarded to Bug Tracker since I did it while missing myself in debug mode when the D option

Image
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby Fourth Inversion » 30 Aug 2015, 04:37

Potential deck for the Fungus Master, based around the evolve mechanic.
| Open
.12875 2 Adaptive Snapjaw
.13119 2 Battering Krasis
.12937 4 Elusive Krasis
.13205 4 Renegade Krasis
.252 2 Tropical Island
.13058 2 Simic Guildgate
.12909 4 Cloudfin Raptor
.8186 4 Coiling Oracle
.1232 3 Simic Sky Swallower
.13031 2 Prime Speaker Zegana
.91 8 Forest
.126 8 Island
.11985 4 Hinterland Harbor
.1393 2 Tidings
.4394 3 Bifurcate
.8176 1 Biomantic Mastery
.11454 3 Green Sun's Zenith
.10802 2 Nature's Claim

This is a possible deck for the Summoner - he seemed like the best candidate for a Eldrazi summoning minion, but at present, he's stuck with Colossus of Akros instead.
| Open
.8916 4 Dryad Arbor
.11454 3 Green Sun's Zenith
.91 23 Forest
.11565 4 Beast Within
.10655 4 Scute Mob
.9517 1 Dramatic Entrance
.13377 2 Arbor Colossus
.13410 1 Colossus of Akros
.9847 4 Primalcrux
.11162 2 Primeval Titan
.6757 1 Plated Slagwurm
.1268 1 Silvos, Rogue Elemental
.1513 1 Gaea's Cradle
.4766 2 Skyshroud Claim
.10793 4 Leatherback Baloth
.11156 1 Overwhelming Stampede
.13323 1 Primeval Bounty
.1243 1 Harmonize

In the past few weeks, I've been distracted by Magic Duels, but I'll be starting on a playthrough of Shandalar tonight, and I'm looking forward to trying out the new decks posted here as I go!
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby Draggamor » 30 Aug 2015, 09:57

I totally agree that AI decks must be changed to what we have available now in the card portfolio. But that must be trended carefully, remember back then the decks where also made considering level of difficulty of the opponents.

On your suggestion I concur with the Summoner deck since it is supposed to be the second stronger green opponent, but the Fungus Master is a bit overpowered.
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby Draggamor » 30 Aug 2015, 10:08

Rodil

Great guideline for deck building.
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby KremlinKook » 14 Sep 2015, 08:29

Thanks, Rodil, for your effort. The lists are great to use with the deck injector. These decks are way too powerful for the early game when playing without the injector, though, when you're playing a stack of junk that's worst than a sealed deck. Lots of fun. Thanks.
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby rodil » 14 Sep 2015, 20:05

Yeah, the challenge level is probably a lot higher than most people want, I was able to beat the set on the highest difficulty, but it involved a lot of running away, a lot of loosing and a lot of rebuying lost cards. If you want a LONG game where your final record is going to be either in the red or in the 50/50 area, use my decks for the enemies, if not they are still fun decks to play around with.

My first time through I was using an easier difficulty and was able to put together a decent red aggro/burn deck pretty quickly which is good against most of the decks with the low life totals so I didn't see quite how challenging the set was until I played the higher difficulty run.

There are still some card choices that I would change in some of the decks and a bug or two I haven't been able to pinpoint yet. Also there are some decks that don't fit very well in the power level of the set as a whole and some that play too similarly to others. But overall I am fairly happy with how the set turned out, thanks to all who have tried it out and who will try it out. I hope to update it at some point in the future for fixes and improvement but I don't think I'm going to until we get more cards to play with.

If you want a quick fix:
-Put in something other than mudslide in the red centaur deck as that breaks the prison(another vigilance creature would be nice).
-Find the bug in the conjurer deck(if it's still there after Thieves2) and replace it.
-Sedge beasts giant deck is neat but seems way weaker than everything else.

Yes the set is hard, especially in the beginning, but I expect magic in person to be about 50/50 and against this computer AI to be about 70/30, going 7 wins 3 losses still hurts a LOT with ante so I feel the losses are a LOT more noticable, especially when you jump into a dungeon and have to run perfect for a while. If I'm not losing a fair number of times on the harder difficulties I'm not really enjoying the game. Maybe I'll make a more 'fun but easy' set sometime too, but again, I'd need more cards.

Thanks again for the time and input.
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby damicore » 24 Sep 2015, 04:21

How do you guys know exactly what cards are available in Korath's Thieves Hideout?
I want to make some decks for the AI but I can't seem to find a good list.
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Re: Shandalar enemy decks overhaul

Postby Korath » 24 Sep 2015, 05:15

There's a link to instructions in every release post, though those are admittedly a bit information-dense. (And, looking at it now, the linked post is missing a bit of context. Start deck.exe, then follow the directions in the posted screenshot.)
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