New Forum Style Changes

[mtgrares]

Hm...I'm not sure how to put this politely but I really don't like how these forums look now. I think everything is "too-white" and blinding by eyes. Maybe MTG Forge should change forums? What does everyone else think?

[GandoTheBard]

I think that despite the look which I detest we owe a debt of loyalty to slightlymagic.net. Jumping ship just because of some bad decisions about style is a bit precipitous.

[mtgrares]

I love the autocard feature, it is great. Hopefully (in the future) I will be the sole owner of the next forum. I won't move anytime soon but I'm just amazed at other people's style. (I'm sure people think the same thing when they boot-up MTG Forge and see the user interface, lol.)

[Rob Cashwalker]

I'm slowly getting used to it... at least GH changed the icons to better show new posts. Look, in all honesty, we can always throw one up on the free web account. But Like Gando said, we have a home here. Our community includes people from the other projects, "one stop shopping". The user profile options has an option to choose the theme, the problem is, the only option available is THIS theme.

[Mr.Chaos]

I have to agree with Rares on the white being rather harsh on the eyes.
Especially when typing a message, the screen is one big white heap, no borders, no way of seeing the exact edge of the typing area. For me, that really is a downer.
Then there is the lack of separation between posts in each forum. The old way of color marking each post was better in my opinion.
But this forum has one good point, the auto-card. (the text of a card popping up if you move over the name of a magic card) I really like that.

Still...home sweet home and all that, even if it isn't all that sweet at the moment.
So, I say we stay here, unless we find ourselves a virtual palace where everything is perfect.

Oh, one more thing: that horrible little dweep of a sorcerer in the top left corner.
Seriously, get rid of it. It's appearance is childish, at best.

[Huggybaby]

If anybody had stepped up nine months ago when I asked for help, this whole mess could have been avoided, and GH could have saved the money he spent out of his own pocket for the new theme. I'm sure he would have preferred not to be bothered with it.

I really got irked when I read one guy's complaint (settle down, he's not in the MTG Forge forum) because I know he never bothers to read anything but some of the posts within his own forum, and will not participate anywhere else. So be it. But if you can't be bothered to read anything else here, it behooves you to at least read the General Discussion forum, where we try to

Discuss anything concerning this site and it's contents.

The obvious solution to this problem is to provide GH with a different theme, rather than bitching about the new ones. I have my problems with the new theme too, but my, and our, only choice is to work it out "within the system".

So, does anyone have some ideas how to improve this situation? There are ten styles to choose from now, and if someone wants to do some editing I'm pretty sure GH will make it eleven. I for one would LOVE to see something different, but unfortunately my lack of skills on this subject and time constraints in general preclude me from doing anything but what I already have, which is asking for help.

[frwololo]

HuggyBaby, your initial question was "how to change the logo?". I must admit I overlooked that post, as it didn't seem that huge a change (changing the logo of a phpBB forum is as easy as replacing the image file).
I like the default phpBB theme. It is the result of years of experience in forums usability by the phpBB team, and every newcomer knows where to find stuff with the default theme, since it's used on so many forums.

That being said, I guess it's just a matter of getting used to the new one, and I respect the owners' decision.

Also, forge, if I were you I wouldn't move from this forum. This place is an amazing pool of people sharing ideas, which a dedicated forum wouldn't have. Seriously, how often do you go to the Wagic forums (not the one here, but the one on my website), or the Deckbot forums?
I know I wouldn't go to a dedicated Forge forum if it existed, while I daily read the messages in the slightlymagic/forge subforum

[Almost_Clever]

I did not like the new layout at first -- the first few days the main menu was on the right, there were some vertical lines through the middle of the page, and I couldn't tell which posts hadn't been read (I saw the layout problems on both my home and work computer). However, the layout is now rendered correctly and the only problem I run into is that sometimes the font size on the page will just change while I'm typing or reading a post. It was close to unreadable at first, but I'm fine with it now.

[GandoTheBard]

If anybody had stepped up nine months ago when I asked for help, this whole mess could have been avoided, and GH could have saved the money he spent out of his own pocket for the new theme. I'm sure he would have preferred not to be bothered with it.

I really got irked when I read one guy's complaint (settle down, he's not in the MTG Forge forum) because I know he never bothers to read anything but some of the posts within his own forum, and will not participate anywhere else. So be it. But if you can't be bothered to read anything else here, it behooves you to at least read the General Discussion forum, where we try to

Discuss anything concerning this site and it's contents.

The obvious solution to this problem is to provide GH with a different theme, rather than bitching about the new ones. I have my problems with the new theme too, but my, and our, only choice is to work it out "within the system".

So, does anyone have some ideas how to improve this situation? There are ten styles to choose from now, and if someone wants to do some editing I'm pretty sure GH will make it eleven. I for one would LOVE to see something different, but unfortunately my lack of skills on this subject and time constraints in general preclude me from doing anything but what I already have, which is asking for help.

1) I had no idea it was paid for (sad that)
2) It should be a simple matter of changing some of the values to make it more palatable. And maybe getting rid of/changing some of the graphics. Anyone (even without any CSS knowledge) should be able to handle this with a little tutoring. The real problem is achieving a consensus on what the board should look like.

[mtgrares]

I realize that this is a touchy subject. Everytime I make a small change to MTG Forge (like filtering 1/1 creatures) I usually get some backlash. I realize that any style changes that you make probably would be criticized. Unforunately I also understand that criticism is cheap, even mine. (Just ask any actor that spent a year making a film and then gets blasted by critics.)

I'm sorry that money was spent. I'm still running a 733 Pentium 2 with a old-fashioned, square moniter (I didn't realize everyone had widescreen monitors until I saw that it was the only kind that Walmart sold.)

Ultimately the decision is yours and Goblin King's. My program wasn't designed by a committee but was designed solely for my entertainment. Very little feedback that I get about MTG Forge is actually useful.

p.s.
Thanks again for giving MTG Forge a forum.

[MageKing17]

I realize that this is a touchy subject. Everytime I make a small change to MTG Forge (like filtering 1/1 creatures) I usually get some backlash. I realize that any style changes that you make probably would be criticized. Unforunately I also understand that criticism is cheap, even mine. (Just ask any actor that spent a year making a film and then gets blasted by critics.)

Just like WotC changing things... everyone's ready to jump on them for ruining Magic forever.

I'm sorry that money was spent. I'm still running a 733 Pentium 2 with a old-fashioned, square moniter (I didn't realize everyone had widescreen monitors until I saw that it was the only kind that Walmart sold.)

Hey, I'm still using a square monitor. Sure, it's the only computer in my house that isn't widescreen, but it's not widescreen, damnit.

[GandoTheBard]

My program wasn't designed by a committee but was designed solely for my entertainment. Very little feedback that I get about MTG Forge is actually useful.

p.s.
Thanks again for giving MTG Forge a forum.

How to not win friends and to negatively influence people...
My point being...Oh really? not useful? I beg to differ. You might not like what people say but a) It is attention to something you did. Good for you for doing. and b) A lot of improvement in MTGForge has been through user feedback even if you weren't hands-on involved in those improvements.

Criticism is what it is. You can take it or leave it. As an artist I have to be open to comments if I am interested in showing my works to people with an eye towards improvement. On the other hand I love this phrase from the 12 steps "If it doesn't apply, let it fly." Meaning take the useful parts and forget the rest. I personally think you can probably use A LOT of the comments made if only to illustrate that people respond to certain things.

There is a fine line I think between being a sensitive artisté and being a prima donna. The sensitive artisté (read: programmer in your case) needs to be self centered a bit to avoid losing focus. This doesn't mean ignoring all outside influence but recognizing things as they are and taking what is good. (It is sometimes harder to recognize what IS good but that is a matter of practice.)

In reference to the styles of the forum (of which this thread is about) I think the styles are not great. In fact I deplore them as a designer but if someone laid out good money for them then they should get their money's worth. (To my mind that would be a refund but barring that we just have to live with it and not moan and whine about it.) It is livable after all.

[GandoTheBard]

everyone's ready to jump on them for ruining Magic forever.

Well the fact of the matter is WotC Ruins and saves Magic on a daily basis. Have been doing so since day 1. I exaggerate only slightly.

[MageKing17]

everyone's ready to jump on them for ruining Magic forever.

Well the fact of the matter is WotC Ruins and saves Magic on a daily basis. Have been doing so since day 1. I exaggerate only slightly.

I've seen old discussions about the 6th Edition rules changes. Everyone, and I mean everyone seemed to think that removing Interrupts and the Damage Prevention Step would ruin the game. That the batch system was "perfectly understandable" and that trading it for some sort of LIFO stack would just make the game needlessly complicated.

There is a fine line I think between being a sensitive artisté and being a prima donna. The sensitive artisté (read: programmer in your case) needs to be self centered a bit to avoid losing focus. This doesn't mean ignoring all outside influence but recognizing things as they are and taking what is good. (It is sometimes harder to recognize what IS good but that is a matter of practice.)

I'll admit, partly I'm just quoting this to draw people's attention to it, because it's important information. It would be impossible to count the number of projects that failed from paying either too much or too little attention to suggestions/criticism. Reminds me of a quote from Voltaire: "Moderation in all things. Neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy."

[GandoTheBard]

everyone's ready to jump on them for ruining Magic forever.

Well the fact of the matter is WotC Ruins and saves Magic on a daily basis. Have been doing so since day 1. I exaggerate only slightly.

I've seen old discussions about the 6th Edition rules changes. Everyone, and I mean everyone seemed to think that removing Interrupts and the Damage Prevention Step would ruin the game. That the batch system was "perfectly understandable" and that trading it for some sort of LIFO stack would just make the game needlessly complicated. <snip>

You said a mouthful there...lol people were so angry they actually quit the game and came back a year later chagrined ...these are the same people who claim that the sky is falling now :p The fact of the matter is if they said we had to play 3 games of checkers in order to qualify for a magic tournament we would do it (assuming we played tournaments). No matter how ridiculous the changes get we will adapt and learn and forget.