Damage on the Stack

[davidmiguel]

Would I want to know if the Forge treat the damage on the stack as the rules 2010 ?
If not, is possible implementation in the future ?

Tks

[Marek14]

Well, I presume that yes, you would want to know that.
And yes, the damage is not put on stack, compliant to M10 rules.

[davidmiguel]

But if I play with Ghost Council of Orzhova the your effect won't work in the stack ?
Cause in the Forge have the option of mana burns.

[friarsol]

But if I play with Ghost Council of Orzhova the your effect won't work in the stack ?
Cause in the Forge have the option of mana burns.

If you are asking for pre-M10 rules for combat damage using the stack, I doubt we'll ever go back to that as an optional rule. There are some major differences between how combat works with the old and new rules. Mana burn is a pretty easy thing to add, whenever a mana pool empties just make players lose some life if there was mana in there. But pre-m10 combat is vastly different than post-m10 combat.

[davidmiguel]

ok, thk

[Max mtg]

I think this change is worth implementing. All that advanced damage prevention cards (missing Archont from WWK and a white card from kamigawa block) would become forgeable. Under new rules each player would just auto-pass when damage goes to stack, meanwhile pre-M10 rules fans might get priority to play instants.

[friarsol]

All that advanced damage prevention cards (missing Archont from WWK and a white card from kamigawa block) would become forgeable.

Care to explain why you think this is true?

[Max mtg]

All that advanced damage prevention cards (missing Archont from WWK and a white card from kamigawa block) would become forgeable.

Care to explain why you think this is true?

Sure. In current implementation all damage is dealt as soon as it is decided that a source can deal damage to target. And there is no point when you can review all the damage to be dealt.

Putting all damage on stack will create that buffer. Since all the possible damage is retained (and not immediatelly dealt by an iterator passing over all Pyroclasm victims) players who have just cast Shining Shoal for 3 will have an option to save all of their 3 Grizzly Bears. They see the expected damage to each creature and distribute the prevention effect

When there exist prevention effects (and post-m10 rules are used), damage should be detained anyway, but players won't be given priority, but instead a special action might be executed asking how to apply prevention/redirection effects.

[friarsol]

All that advanced damage prevention cards (missing Archont from WWK and a white card from kamigawa block) would become forgeable.

Care to explain why you think this is true?

Sure. In current implementation all damage is dealt as soon as it is decided that a source can deal damage to target. And there is no point when you can review all the damage to be dealt.

Putting all damage on stack will create that buffer. Since all the possible damage is retained (and not immediatelly dealt by an iterator passing over all Pyroclasm victims) players who have just cast Shining Shoal for 3 will have an option to save all of their 3 Grizzly Bears. They see the expected damage to each creature and distribute the prevention effect

When there exist prevention effects (and post-m10 rules are used), damage should be detained anyway, but players won't be given priority, but instead a special action might be executed asking how to apply prevention/redirection effects.

Your example is a poor one. Damage using the stack is only for Combat damage. Not for spells that deal damage. With spells that deal damage, they are already using the stack (as the spell itself). And just because there is priority between assignment and damage doesn't really mean too much. You can already cast a Healing Salve during declare blockers. The priority is different than the pre-6th edition "prevention/regeneration step" that existed for damage (that people who played Shandalar are familiar with).

Really what we need is a way for players to interact with combat damage and prevention effects (as you mention in your last line), it has nothing to do with whether or not people can abuse Mogg Fanatic. We do already "assign damage" we just don't have this special interaction after assignment is complete. So I don't see how adding this would make these things forgeable. In fact, up until when I re-wrote combat, damage did use the stack, and these cards weren't forgeable then.